A Look Into the Mind of a CrossFit Programmer - Mammoth Training Methods

New to CrossFit or a veteran of the sport, tune in to learn from Coach Josh Woolley of Mammoth Training Methods. Josh breaks down how to build a perfect season of training, what to focus on as a beginner, intermediate or advance athlete. 

Josh is new to the LP Community taking on the LP Programming for our LP Compete club with the intent of helping all club members improve at the sport of CrossFit.

We are extremely lucky to build on this relationship with this high level coach. You may or may not be aware but Josh is Head Coach to one of the top ranked teens in the Sport - Emma Lawson.

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Transcript

Chad [0:23 - 0:30]
Yeah. Welcome to the living that fit like podcast. Episode 27. I'm joined by Adam today on this wonderful Sunday morning. How's it going bud?

Adam [0:31 - 0:33]
Pretty good. Not bad.

Chad [0:34 - 0:40]
Got coffees in hand and today we're are talking to josh woolley from mammoth training methods. How's it going? Josh?

Josh [0:42 - 0:47]
Good, good. Yeah. Thanks for having me on guys looking forward to talking. So. Mhm.

Chad [0:48 - 1:35]
Thanks man. Yeah, so josh is a crossfit coach, Crossfit programmer. Um, most folks in our community know him from coaching some of our sort of local elite athletes, like Emma Lawson and Jack Farlow, um who are actually looking to make the semifinals of the crossfit or at the semifinals, looking to make the games this year. Um, But josh has also been a bigger part of our community the past, uh and maybe six, nine months maybe he's been starting to do a lot of the programming for the LP compete side of things. So we really wanted to sit down and chat with him today um and get his sort of thoughts on programming, what it's like to sort of coach some of the elite athletes and just kind of uh shoot the shit if you are on a sunday morning.

Adam [1:35 - 1:37]
Mhm. Love it.

Josh [1:37 - 1:38]
Um

Chad [1:39 - 2:08]
But I think, I think are folks would like to know maybe we could start off from the start, um sort of maybe call this like your, your formal introduction to the limitless community. Um I love to learn more about your sort of fitness or athletic background. You know, what was finished like for you growing up? Were you like a team sports guy? Global jim guy kind of maybe paint us a picture of sort of what your athletic background was before sort of maybe before crossfit or even before L. P.

Josh [2:10 - 4:53]
Yeah so uh his most good Canadian boys grew up playing hockey um Okay junior junior throughout Ontario and then ended up crashing on my career with University of Waterloo Varsity men's teams. So um yeah fairly high level of hockey and that kind of introduced me to uh training in the gym and on the track and stuff like that. Obviously the training was very specific to performing on the ice. Um Looking back now I wish I had found crossfit or kind of that methodology of training while I was playing hockey because during the peak of my crossfit career. Yeah because in the best shape of my life and I was transferred over to the drink as well. So Yeah, I played hockey up until I was 23, when I graduated, um, had a couple opportunities to go play, um, you know, some semi pro down in the states, but figured it was it was time, had a good career. Um, and decided to hang them up once they graduated. So across it was kind of just the natural evolution for someone who used to compete and enjoys working out. So yeah, first stumbled into across the gym shortly after the end of the school year and since then been kind of involved in that community and really enjoyed the training. Um, you know, was pretty competitive to an extent. Um, you know, not at the level of adam or uh, the team kids that we're working with now, but um, you know, had some close calls with some regional teams back in regionals were thing with crossfit Cambridge and yeah, that's kind of after after the competition setting decided to move over to the coaching and it kind of just happened naturally, wasn't like something that I was like thinking about. Um the opportunity kind of arose with with Emma and uh ran from there with it. So it's been a lot of learning over the past few years with coaching. Um but it's it's something that I'll definitely, you know, continue doing for hopefully many years to come get a lot of satisfaction from helping athletes and then helping people kind of achieve what they want in their goals. And then uh you know, still being involved in that that community aspect that cross provides. So yeah, it's kind of a little bit about me and my background, so

Chad [4:53 - 4:58]
I have to ask before we dive into crossfit what kind of hockey player you you're pretty big dude.

Josh [5:00 - 5:31]
Yeah, so in junior I was I was, you know, I can get the puck in the net if I had to uh pretty physical though. Um And then at the varsity level it was a lot of extra HL guys. So it was pretty, pretty competitive hockey. Um You know, definitely more of a role player. They're still still put the puck in the net a few times, but definitely, you know, the penalty kill play, the body be the grinder. So uh yeah, I was kind of my role later on their career.

Adam [5:32 - 5:48]
Yeah, I don't think I keep saying this to josh like him and I never played against each other, but for some reason I always kind of followed josh through his hockey career and like he played, you played for Al Mira in my right.

Josh [5:48 - 5:56]
Yeah, I play from Cairo and we won the cup back in 2011. It's not

Adam [5:57 - 7:58]
yeah, I forget if I was still playing at that point or I was coaching with uh with the Dutchman at that point anyway, so just like what attracted me to josh was that team sport background and I'm like, okay, what I look like, I love the crossfit side of things, but supercross fitty coaches and athletes kind of didn't really align with what I loved about crossfit, which was like that all around fitness perspective and then josh coming from hockey, the same training and background that I had, I knew his approach to training was um yeah, more of that building, that super strong athlete um and that's kind of josh and I had cross past a few times and I had seen his athletes, you know, training and saw how balanced and strong uh and healthy they were. And then I finally reached out to him coming off of endurance season last year and I said, buddy, I want to take it to the next level and want to follow a super solid program. And that was all of last year september until the open and then into the quarter finals and I would say he got me that kind of missing link or missing piece that I was always kind of hunting for in terms of um my skill and uh balance and attacking my weaknesses in the open and in the in the quarterfinals and then cross street in general. So that's kind of how and helping the other LP members in turn, because all of the other athletes members who were doing the open and and did the quarterfinals, they got a taste of his programming to, and we saw them take their training to the next level, which was amazing. So kind of a cool progression.

Chad [7:58 - 8:05]
Yes. As we know when Adam does something, the rest of the gym does it, you get to suffer a little bit with them to

Adam [8:05 - 8:07]
the guinea pigs.

Chad [8:07 - 8:28]
Um, So yeah, so I'm gonna talk about crossfit. So how did you find crossfit? Like I'm assuming your training was very much hockey specific. Global gym type training before that. And then obviously training to something like crossfit. So like what got you in the crossfit and like how did you make that sort of transition?

Josh [8:29 - 11:12]
Yeah, So I remember actually the first time that I saw or heard about crossfit um in the like we kind of have like are changing and dressing room and a like a playerslounge up in water earlier and uh I remember I was in there one day, I don't know if I was studying for exams and whatnot, but I just had the tv on, I was flicking through and then um, it was a video of one of the events and forget the year of the games, but it was like this huge like Marathon run swim and by eight in California, I think it was like the camp Pendleton event. Anyway, it was like these dudes who are just like jack running and like I was like, what is this? And so I just ended up like watching the rest of the event and then kind of follow the games that weekend and there's just a holy cow like this is pretty cool, like, you know, this is something I could definitely see myself getting into. So yeah, from that when I was kind of hooked and then like, you know, started trying to learn some of the movements while at the school, still in. It's working out in the gym there and getting some weird looks, but it is what it is. And then after, after I finished up school, one of my buddies, um, then I knew just through summer hockey was, was a member at a gym in Cambridge, Crossfit c town. Um, so yeah, I ended up joining there. I was there for a couple of years. Um, and then moved over to Crossfit Cambridge. And that's really where I started more of my competitive career chat hall was back then and he programmed for a group of competitive athletes and that's really kind of opened my eyes to the difference between, you know, your normal crossfit athlete goes into a gym and does like the daily um, Exxon, there are the strengths of the group and you know, you get pretty fit and you get pretty good the skills. But if you want to compete, there's an entirely different kind of kind of stretcher to the training. It's not so much, I don't want to say that like elite cross fitters don't do crossfit because they do, but I don't believe that they just solely do crossfit to get where they're at. So I think there's a lot of um, you know, planning and um, you know, foresight that goes into their, into their training plan um that allows them to kind of get to the level they're at because just doing crossfit, like I don't think you do like it there, you're gonna get super fit, but there's gonna be a lot of polls and you're on your overall athleticism.

Chad [11:14 - 11:35]
Cool. And how many and how long when you got the cross that you started getting competitive crossfit? And then you sort of turn the pages you can mention already to sort of start coaching. And then I imagine sort of, you know, mammoth started was was sort of born. So like how did Mammoth get started? And how did you sort of make that transition through sort of that those years?

Josh [11:36 - 13:30]
Yeah. So what year was it? So 2018 after the Open that year? Um, you know, I was probably the best shape of my life and I kind of had, yeah, bit of like, I don't see an injury, but like a nagging thing that won't go away through the Open. Um, and so I didn't have a performance that I wanted to have. Um, but really wasn't looking to go through another year of the grind. Obviously I still work out and still enjoy being in shape. Um, but the opportunity came up with Emma, so she actually did the open that year, A 13 year old, so she didn't sign up, but she just did the workouts and then it kind of scale them accordingly to her capacity then. Um Remember her like just destroying these workouts as a 13 year old and it's just like, what is going on? Like who is this kid? Um You know, I've known who she was from the gym and her family and stuff but really hadn't seen her her work out. And uh I remember making a comment to her mom, I said, hey, like how much should stop dance? So she was a competitive dancer and she should stop dancing and and take on crossfit. Like all culture kind of just like, you know, how far did you just say that? Um I don't think civil Evans mom was too too impressed. She was the dance moms so called him as a dancer. But yeah, I'm a kind of made up her mind. Um, after the Open that year that it was something that she wanted to take on. And uh, yeah, her parents came to me and said, hey, like, are you, are you serious? Like you would you go into culture and yeah, from there as the captain, let's do this. And the small in at that point. And that was kind of like the birth of mammoth training methods. Um, yeah, so that's kind of how how things started.

Chad [13:31 - 13:51]
It's and, and so, so where did like, why did you start focusing on the programming aspect crossed it? And because like, you know, you could have just jumped into com train or one of the, at that time, I think programming was, there was a lot sort of started coming out, right? So like, but made you sort of focus on the programming aspect and get dialogue and not just coaching them?

Josh [13:51 - 17:31]
Yeah, so I obviously a notable con train and like Invictus had a competitive tracked as well, um and those are, you know, they're good in their own sense, but they're definitely not tailored to the individual, right? Like you're trying to encompass, you know, really wide at um and hopefully like you're too anyone following that, like, hopefully you're able to continue to develop your skills and work on your weaknesses, but the program is tailored to you, like, there's a good opportunity that you're going to miss out on certain things, right? So I knew from, from that standpoint that working with Emma, I really wanted to set a framework and put in the ground work at the beginning to make sure that we're doing the little things right? So moving properly, you know, developing a lot of stretched strength before diving into the the fancy cross gymnastic stuff uh in the, you know, very technical olympic lifting. So we spent a like a really long time um dialing things in and working on technique and they're working on that strict strength even though she had the capacity and the capability to do ring muscle ups and do you know, kipping butterfly pull ups. Um It was probably like three or 4 months of training before I actually ever program that into a workout, and I always told her and I told the other coaches who are coaching across the Cambridge at the time, it's just where she was training that like if she jumps into a class squad, but like I don't want her doing butterfly pull up, so don't encourage her to do them to go faster, like we're going to focus on the strict stuff first. Um and so I really think that paid off and when we started to incorporate the more technical movements, um she had the strength and joins the stuff to stay healthy through that and where else, dial in the proper movement patterns and ensure that we weren't kind of making some of the mistakes that I made um teach to myself, um some of those shortcuts and just moving well. And I think that's translated to her being extremely healthy through the past three years of training. She really hasn't had at the injury that prevented her from training. Obviously you're going to have times where you may be a little bit sore, but there's been nothing that's really held their back and I think that's been huge to her for very rapid success in the sport. So that was, that was my main thinking with that. Um Obviously I learned a lot by uh my training with chad and how he programmed for crossfit Cambridge competitive group. Um, and then, yeah, and kind of incorporated my own, my own twist known thoughts on things and figured, you know, if I can just make a really solid athlete, that's good that, you know, any thing that we put them into, its going to translate books a crossfit. And uh, yeah, that's kind of my main focus in training plans and programming is just making a well rounded athlete, not necessarily a great cross fitter, but it's so well rounded athlete. And then when it comes time to kind of start dialing in for a particular crossfit event such as the Open, we're going to have that lead at a time where we'll start kind of hitting the things that we know we're going to show up and making sure that we are, are dialed in and ready to go with that.

Chad [17:33 - 17:52]
Cool. Um this whole time you were talking, I was like, man, what gave this guy the confidence to sort of just like build this program for like a young athlete, like, like what you kind of mentioned that you were kind of uh leveraging uh the main coach at crossword Cambridge. But like, what were some of the levers that you pulled from? Like, Because like, it's one thing like

Josh [17:52 - 17:53]
coaching and the other

Chad [17:53 - 17:54]
thing is like giving someone a

Josh [17:54 - 17:55]
structure and a plan

Chad [17:55 - 18:15]
of like how to build a, you know, like you said, a durable body, especially at a young age, right? Like what were you pulling on to kind of start building? I'm sure I asked that question because like after sometimes think about other programs, programmers that come up with, like new programs is like why are they so good, where are they pulling it from? Um So I'm interested to get your sense of that.

Josh [18:19 - 21:07]
Yeah, so um I do pull a lot of um okay, the body balance in strict strength work from um Marcus Philly stuff, so he obviously was a cross with teams athlete for a long time and then kind of moved more into the functional bodybuilding scene, but a lot of his stuff and like his movement patterns um really lead to that kind of based development. Um you know, really making sure nobody is well balanced and strong, so that way you can start building after that and then um you know, understanding that crossfit as main, I guess like core is very much in the aerobic style sports, obviously there are events that are, you know, anaerobic shorter, but for the most part you're kind of in that six to 20 minute time domain. Um So developing a really strong aerobic based is super important. Um One of the things I really enjoy doing is more of that steady state, What kind of work? Um lt we we program that usually on Wednesday mornings Where you know, you're not going hard and you're kind of cruising around that, 60, 80 70% effort um for extended duration. Right? And that's a really good way to kind of develop that just felt like zone too. And there is um which is huge in that crossfit scene, right? Like if you can kind of developed that, yeah, that part of your aerobic kind of capacity and really increase that range that you can work in, its going to carry over into all of the events and your capability to recover during events. Um It's also going to carry over into, you know, those really fast short time domain events as well, even though you're not directly working on that, anaerobic anaerobic threshold that, you know, large aerobic basis is critical. Like if you don't have it, you're not going to be um you won't be successful in sport, you can be super strong and you can Lift £400 and that would not be an issue and you might win the heavy lifting them, but, you know, Well, I'm sure you've seen people like that, right? Like they left super heavy and then you ask them to go around 400 and 800, do some push ups and stuff and they're absolutely dead. So. Yeah, yeah, that's kind of my focus, right? Like build a huge aerobic base, make sure your athletes very well balanced, healthy and moving well and then from there you can you can start kind of building in the other pieces that they need.

Adam [21:09 - 22:17]
I think it's so cool, just I think actions speak louder than words with josh and Emma is truly that um that kind of all around solid foundation athletes, it's so easy to get caught up in the gimmicky stuff, the stuff that makes you go faster, the high skilled movements. Um and you see a lot of athletes that get into crossfit, they have that kind of high where they're getting better, better, better and then if they don't have that strong base of conditioning and strength, they're either injured or they hit like a ceiling and a plateau, which forces them to go back to the to the ground work and start over again. So it's so cool to see that pay off and not get caught up following that kind of traditional gimmicky learning how to do, you know, master butterfly pull ups and rope climbs and uh some of the fun stuff but not the stuff that actually is gonna make you healthy strong athlete long term.

Josh [22:17 - 24:00]
Yeah. Like I wouldn't say my programming is like particularly like crossfit sexy. Like I wouldn't say it's like some, you know, really, really like cool stuff. But I remember fraser had an interview and he said like they asked, hey are you going to sell your program? And he's like, no one's gonna do my programming like boring like, but it's like those, it's the simple things that I think really do create the that base that you need. Um What did he say? Like he was doing just some lifting and like just longer imams or so long leading up to the open that his first real crossfit workout was the first work out of the open. Like he he didn't really do like a crossfit workout leading up to that, right? So might be a building extreme. But like for him obviously at work and I think there's something in in that, you know that if you're just hammering cross at work, I was like Adam was saying like you're gonna yeah, as a new athlete coming in, like you're going to see a pretty rapid improvement, but then you're gonna hit that plateau and if you don't have kind of that base, you're not going to know how to get through that plateau. And it can be frustrating obviously for a lot of athletes and some people you know, might just give up at that point. Um you know, hopefully they stay healthy and keep with it. But having kind of that base and going through that boring stuff for however long it takes is kind of critical to get to that, you know, level that you want to be at in order to compete or, or to speak healthy. Healthier opening. Yeah, exactly,

Chad [24:01 - 24:33]
yeah, I think um yeah, that's maybe continue the conversation uh sort of Emma and sort of your elite athletes, um you know, she's been dominant, I think a lot of folks who followed her, she's been dominant in the teenager division, announced she's competing alongside some of like the elites, right? Um and she's at such a young age and hopefully we can get him on the pod one day. But how are you approaching this year's crossfit season with her, Jack, some of the other younger athletes that you are working with?

Josh [24:34 - 25:26]
Yeah, so um Jack just recently joined in after the Open. So he had been with Mayhem, the Mayhem athlete program um got through the open. Um He wasn't super sure if he would be kind of in that qualification spot in the quarterfinals. Um You know I no, he was we were sure you get through the open to the quarters and then once we get to the corners, he didn't think he'd be able to crack into that semi final, that semi final thing. Um So yeah, I started working with him right after the open. Um and then obviously anyone who knows checks and keep super strong, like probably one of the strongest Canadian Crossfit athletes, especially being 19 like,

Chad [25:26 - 25:29]
can you give us a number just to the listeners?

Josh [25:29 - 26:39]
Yeah, so uh she his pr snatches to 85 He's flirting like with 2 95 300 like he's right that um he's had a couple like really close attempts at 2 95. Um and then he just last week here's cleaning her at 365. So yeah he's 19. Yeah he's 19 so he's super strong but his weakness was more so in the aerobic stuff, right? So he kind of neglected that in order to get strong and was probably a little bit heavy right? Obviously with with mass comes from strength. Um So that definitely would have an ambulance on you know, gymnastic stuff and any kind of bodyweight movements. Herpes you name it like they're just going to cause them to his heart rate to elevate and keep going through it. So that was kind of our main focus leading into semifinals. Just kind of improving on that even if his strength took a hit. Um Which apparently didn't because you're still carrying all the stuff. So that's what

Chad [26:39 - 27:21]
I have a question about that actually, because like I hear a lot of times um Ben version and other sort of people talk with us but like and Building strength for young athletes is key within like 13 years, you can't it's harder for someone to build strength when they're in their 20's or 30s. Is that like one of the like maybe did Jack do it right? Like he built so much strength in his teens, knowing that his aerobic capacity was sort of faulty and but his aerobic capacity he can learn now leading into his twenties and still be the same athlete or maybe a better athlete in the future. Like do you have some like do you kind of live in that kind of methodology of like building strength with a young athlete is like the most important thing to do?

Josh [27:22 - 27:59]
Um Yeah, I'd say it's like it's definitely up there, I would agree that that building strength as you get older is tougher, like I have a hard time building strength can be frustrating, especially when I got teenagers who are listening, but um so yeah, definitely building strength early is important. Um But I still think that like you can build elite strength and also develop an elite, you know aerobic system at the same time. Um you just need to be smart with how you do it, which

Chad [27:59 - 28:00]
I guess your examples

Josh [28:00 - 32:58]
which she's doing that. Yes, I'm a super obviously super strong, she has an amazing capacity to do work. Um you know, some of her numbers just for the audience, so uh secure character smashed. Um I have 185 As a, she just turned 16 or she was 15, so 2055 and then recently Hit 2 45, birth and jerk. Um So yeah, those are pretty aggressive numbers. Um but like you look at the field that's competing this weekend at the Granite Games, 2-17 year olds in there. Okay. They have a year of training off on the enema, but they're stashing £200 clean and drinking the same, but not more than that. She is. So yeah, you gotta be strong obviously. But um As cool as, you know, one rep max desire, like usually it's just one event, right? So great. Like, you can get a lot of weight but can you lift, you know, 90% or 85% of your one that max from multiple reps in a short time window, right? That's more so what I focus on, like, it's cool if you pr and your snatch awesome. A great accomplishment. But I'm more happy to see you, you know, now lift 85% and do 15 reps and pr that time by 30 seconds, right? But that's way more transferable to the prospect space than, you know, Increasing your snatch by £5.. So it's kind of yeah, my my my my thinking on the strength stuff, I think both can be done in conjunction and I think it's important, especially if the athlete has goals of competing at the highest level, like now, you know, if they just want to get strong and they worry about their conditioning afterwards, great, we'll do that, but if they want to be near the top um now, like you need to develop both and I think you can you just need to be smart about how you do it. Um Yeah, that's kind of Jack Story, I guess. We can talk a little bit about Emma. So yeah, when I started working with her as we talked really focused on the fundamentals and developing a really solid base. Um, She finished 3rd in the Crossfit Games in her rookie year is a 14 year old and 1415 She put, she she won the open as a 15 year old in the 1415 group, won the Adria Bonin qualifier and then obviously things with COVID didn't happen. You know, that was bitter, bitter pill to swallow, but it also allows us to kind of focus on the upcoming year. Um, you know, she was in line in my opinion to, to win that year, like she had everything that she needed, but you can't control the climate of the world. So that's unfortunate. But um, you know, for those who know her, she is a very modest individual and you know, all those, she was upset that things didn't work out that year. She she got right back into it and we kind of started her goals and plans for for this season and uh you know, one of the things That she said as you know, she wants to qualify as a teenager in the 1617 age group um and get back to the games and do well there and then I kind of challenge her with a like, you know, do you think you have what it takes to potentially qualify as a an elite individual, right? Like, um you know, knowing that I think she has the capacity and the skill to do that, she definitely has the commitment and the drive um not knowing what the season was going to look like. You know, it was kind of challenging, but it's something that she's like, you know, like that would be really, really cool, right? Um, so we kind of left it open ended and um, but it was in her mind and I think as the season has progressed and as her training has gone through the different cycles and got through the open And she finished 15th in the world, like, Wow, amazing. Um, and then hit the quarterfinals, did really welcome the quarterfinals and I was, you know, I think the fourth ranked athlete going into the atlas semifinal, um, she has the excellent opportunity to potentially be the the youngest athlete ever to qualify for the games in the league, right, Going back to the granite games. Like we're probably gonna have to 17 year old females qualify, I think they're sitting 12 right now in the last days. So yeah, we're going to see teenagers at the crossfit games in the elite division. Um Why not? Like why? Why not? I'm alright, but she's she's right there. So

Adam [32:58 - 33:25]
yeah, and it seems like we've talked about this before, but two months for a 16 year old of training, three months of training. You see like massive improvements over such a short window of time. And that's the coolest part is like the open. It was in March, the quarterfinals were in april. Now the semis are near the end of june, it's like two more months of more progress, which is amenable.

Chad [33:25 - 33:36]
Yeah. Like what what is the common thread? Because the common thread is this year is that there's a lot of younger athletes making a significantly to compete with the L. E. It's like what do you think has changed over the past year?

Josh [33:37 - 35:53]
Um Yeah, it's definitely the Haley effect for sure. Like she came onto the scene and did extremely well as a 19 year old or an 1818 year old, 18 year old in her first year of the games, like as an elite. Um And I think it is kind of made it possible for these other teen athletes who are obviously very, very well established, a very good crossfit athletes to kind of make that jump. Um It's funny like you are The the 1415, so whatever that age group is, so in his age group, in a year older, it just seems like there's a, you know, a handful of athletes in that group or just the exceptional, exceptional athletes. Um And we're seeing that now. All right. So when they were in that 14 15 age group, like we couldn't, they couldn't qualify as an elite because their age group LTD them based on the movements and the loading. They didn't do the same, the same loading as the open group. Right? So once they got into that 16 17 year old, a troop, they're doing the same work out all the same loading. So we're seeing a true representation of where they kind of sit and uh yeah, like there definitely, it's definitely amazing to see like the youth in the sport coming up. Um, especially on the female side, like it just seems like, you know, it's not in the next couple of years. Just like it's now the movements now these kids are here and they're not going anywhere, right? Like they're only gonna get better. And like you're going to see if not this year, next year, you're probably going to see like a handful of teenage off. It's like knocking on the door of the crossfit games and like you look at mala brian like who knows, She could theoretically like podium this year. The games if the work during her favorite, like she's destroying the field that granted game sound like there's Ex Top 10 Crossfit Games athletes. They're like, it's wild, wild this year.

Chad [35:53 - 36:21]
Yeah, like she looks like a killer. Like honestly like you think about Frasier and Tia and you looked around in the past few years and like you're like no one's gonna beat these two, right? But then now you're starting to see is like, you know what, who's gonna beat these two? Is is Haley or Medeiros? Or maybe like you look at moliro Brown, you can see her right beside to going head to head for sure. And it's crazy like what do you think the future of the sport looks like? Do you think it's going to keep getting younger and younger? And we just haven't found are sort of peak age limit?

Josh [36:21 - 37:13]
Mm I don't think we'll see getting younger and younger. I think you're always going to have kind of a generation of athletes that kind of outside the mould. Like I still think you're going to see The majority of your elite athletes kind of sitting in that 21-25 year old range, maybe a little bit older. But you know, even going back to like hockey with adam, like every once in a while, like every 56 years, like you just get an age group that comes through that just like who are these kids? Like why are they so good? And and I think we're kind of seeing that right now in crossfit. Like we're just kind of having this, I don't want to say it's abnormal, but just like this, You know, very special group of athletes coming through and we might not see another group of athletes for five or six years come through. So um

Adam [37:14 - 37:15]
yeah, these three girls,

Josh [37:15 - 37:17]
exciting, exciting.

Adam [37:17 - 38:07]
These three girls seem to maybe have elevated each other's game over the past three or four years as they competed against each other. They're like, you know, unlocking boundaries that a teenager never would have thought possible because they have each other like, oh, malory hit to 65 on her front squat, I gotta go hit 2 55 of mine, which I didn't think I could do or like I think and and then maybe am I like our am others that also am a Kerry who's very good, but I am a like she's going to now go into the semis probably with a heightened sense of confidence Watching the other two, knowing that she's at that level now she can go in there with the confidence that I can, you know, dominate at the semis as well.

Josh [38:08 - 39:24]
Yeah, Yeah. And Emma like wherever I guess she's very much a like a gamer, right? So when you see her in the gym, um she does much better I think in live competition than she does in the virtual stuff just because she likes that Bush not saying that she is not able to push when she's by herself. Like she does amazing with that. But I think there's just like another year that she's able to hit into when it's alive competition. And that's why I really wish that atlas, like whatever event we went to the semifinals was live, because I think then like we'll be able to see that gear and she'd be able to see that gear because it's been so long since we've been able to do a lot of competition with Covid and stuff, right? Um, so I think, yeah, she looks at the numbers that these other girls are putting up and um, I think sometimes questions, you know, her capability, But um, she's definitely getting a lot better in terms of like that mental strength and knowing that she belongs to be at the same level. Um, it's just that, you know, that extra gear that you get in that live competition, right? Like, you know, oh, I'm getting tired, right? It's like, no, like when you're alive, you have people next to you like, well, they're getting tired too. Like I'm going to push harder. So

Adam [39:25 - 40:17]
yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll have to try to, you know, build as much hype around it. Obviously the polski crew will do that, but as much hype as we can around it so that she feels that, you know, push or or support that she would feel if the fans were, you know, screaming and yelling at her. I've seen her dig deep in, in a few of the online qualifiers that she's done this year. So I feel like, you know, you see her every day, but we see her compete and when she, You know, when she's holding on to a £95 barbell and you know, cycling it for, I think it was a clean and jerk workout and she held on for, you know, 30 reps for grace. Yeah, so we see her dig deep and go into the pancake whether it's in person or online, but it would be fun.

Josh [40:18 - 40:47]
Yeah. And the cool thing with, I guess the scenario we have right now is like both Jack and kate are also doing atlas, so we'll see how we can kind of arrange the gym. Like we might be able to have all three of them go at the same time. So that way they're getting kind of that push that push right? So we'll see what we'll do what we can. Um We'll see, we'll see what happens, right? But I think they both have an excellent shot of, you know, potentially cracking the top five. Maybe it's super cool. Really do

Chad [40:48 - 41:21]
super cool. Yeah, the future of the sports in pretty good hands. Um I wanted to sort of say we had to sort of um you know, we've talked a lot about the the elite sort of programming, the elite athletes that you have. I wanted to ask you more about like how do you program for different levels of athletes? Obviously you started programming for adam when he was going through some of his crossfit stuff. Obviously now you're also programming for you know, general PBP like in L. P. With beginner, intermediate advanced athlete focus. How do you sort of program for the different levels of sort of athletes?

Josh [41:22 - 44:12]
Yep. So again, this is kind of like my first go at more of like a generalized program for a larger group. But I guess like my kind of thought is that um allow the movements like the loading to kind of be self governing, right? So not necessarily specifying hey like you have to do this much weight or you have to do this many reps. Um you know allow the athlete to kind of self govern that. Um but make sure that you're being very clear and what the intent of the of the work or the stimulus is, right? So that way they're aware and they can kind of keep that in mind when they're you know, self governing the workout. So that's kind of my biggest thing. And then in terms of the skill work, like obviously right now it's difficult with not having people being able to be in the gyms. Um so you can't necessarily do a lot of the progression eri work for kind of your beginner athlete or your intermediate athlete um to teach them, you know, you know how to do everything must properly or how to do, you know, a bar muscle upper toast by our handstand push ups. So um our focus right now with the help group is just to kind of start developing that big big bass, right? So we're still a ways out from the open. Um let's use this time right now to make sure we're doing those little things right? And in developing that base and again, we're not doing anything like crazy sexy in terms of the programming, It's just focusing on making sure we're moving well, developing a lot of strict strength um and making sure the body is healthy. So that way, when, when the gyms do open back up, start to kind of transition into a different phase of our training block, the body is ready. So yeah, that's kind of that again, train air programming for different levels of athletes, a lot of it's self governing and again, once the gym's open and people are able to kind of come in, you know, adam's going to be there, the coaches are going to be there and they'll be able to help people out as well if they have questions with specific movements. I know I've kind of talked about um two, we first started, you know, thinking this up is about having some, you know, seminar style days where we actually focus on you know a skill and spend some time in person going over the skill and different progressions. So that way we can, you know, say hey, when the workout says this, this and this and like you know, you don't have this movement, well here's like your proper substitute um and here's how you do it right, so again kind of tough right now with the way things are, but hopefully once things open up we can kind of start doing some more of that.

Adam [44:12 - 45:16]
I think you josh you just value that that based so much it it comes so naturally to you to just focus on that right away and um I think you may be over over, looked like how challenging that is for a new scaled and intermediate in our ex athlete to like understand and and buy into And I think it's awesome that they're getting to just experience. Um The LP compete crew is just, you know, everyone does a great job of following what's prescribed um but it's amazing for them now to get the opportunity to follow the right progression to build their base of strength and their base of of conditioning. Um So that when they're ready for all these skills, you know, in the future, it's a lot easier to do a muscle up or a butterflied pull up when you have an amazing strict pulling strength to get it. So that's

Josh [45:16 - 46:56]
Yeah, I think one thing that when people that kind of question like why are we doing what we're doing? And it just seems like a back squat for example, it's pretty, pretty simple, but you know, a lot of tempo work, right? So we're controlling that decent, we're pausing in the bottom and then why they're happening like an explosive drive up, like a quick reset into our next rep. But like the purpose of the tempo is to develop a lot of tension within the body and a lot of strength in those positions because like you go into like a global gym or like someone who's just starting out, crossfit maybe doesn't have the best coaching. Like you watch them back squat and like they're just like hammering the bottom position and like bouncing back up and like their bus shooting up and like it's just grossed for lack of a better term, right? And uh, you know, for one, it's not healthy and unsafe and it's not something that you can maintain for the long haul. And, and then if you want to translate more over to the competition setting, it's like, okay, like I'm asking you to sit in the bottom of the swat for five seconds, Like you're going to have to maintain tension, force yourself into a good position and then drive out of the hole. So how does that carry over? Well, Let's say, you know, you have a one rep clean, right? And you catch it off a little bit off balance. Now you're stuck in the bottom of the hole and you're kind of repositioning well, you're going to have that strength and comfort in that position knowing that you can stand up, right? We're athletes who don't practice kind of that tempo mike is stuck in the bottom and then they start to panic and you start to panic when you have loading on, you're not standing that up. So there's a lot of carry over in that sense.

Chad [46:57 - 47:58]
And, and I've also like looking like looking at your programming, like, you know, Typically like, you know, we have 60 minutes six million classes back in the gym. There's 60 minutes of programming. I'm actually not 60 minutes of just like straight work, but there's obviously Whatever. And then there's, you know, like 90 minutes, like, you know, like, I guess it doesn't matter the timing, but like, short, medium and small, or along, right? Like is a beginner athlete, can they work out for two hours a day? Like, or is like, like is there a time thing that's specific to sort of like the level of athlete or like going back to what you're talking about was like governing sort of the weights and stuff? Is the cell governance is more about it? But is there a time thing? Like, we have this thought like, only elite athletes and elite individual cross fitters trained for six hours a day and that's why they're elite, right? But like as a beginner or as an intermediate, should I only be working an hour a day? Or can I also be looking at sort of like the two hour window? Do you map it at all? Is there any sort of correlation there?

Josh [47:59 - 51:16]
Um uh Yeah, I don't want to say there's not a correlation, like there's definitely a correlation to um you know, the time you spend training is obviously going to um have an impact on the outcome, but there's a lot more that goes into it than just the amount of time you spend in the gym. So um you know, if you are a new athlete coming in and this is your first time, you know, picking up awaiting doing weights, Should you be in the gym for multiple hours a day? No, like you should be in the gym doing like your normal cost for an hour and getting a good workout in and kind of just getting used to that stimulus. And like as a new athlete coming in like you're going to see that pretty rapid increase in improvement. And a lot of that at the beginning is just kind of that neurological adaptation right? Like your brain is is so amazing at grasping things and telling your muscles how to fire. Um that you're going to see that rapid improvement pretty quick. Um And then kind of once you start seeing that improvement then you stole it slowly start kind of building up that that volume, right? Um But when you start building up the volume there's there's other things that come into play right? Like your nutrition is super important, your recovery is super important. So are you doing your mobility work? Are you getting body work done? Um Are you getting 8.5 hours of sleep? Like those are the things that I think a lot of newer athletes and even some seasoned athletes kind of overlooked and they think, well I can just spend more time in the gym and you know, or look my diet and overlook my rest, but at the end of the day, like if you, if your goal is to be, you know, an elite level crossfit athlete, like there is, it's not just the gym, like it's, there's tons of stuff that you have to do and there are elite level athletes who only spend an hour in gym today, right? Uh but like it's like, okay, I'm going into the gym and this is what I have to do and this is the intent and I'm doing it right. Like I'm a lot of my phone in between sets and wasting time. Like I'm there for an hour, I'm getting this done. Um A lot of people use the gym as a social setting, which is great. It's great that jim's provide that for people. But when you are, you have goals and aspirations that you need to make sure that you're going in there with an intent. Um you have three hours and you can be there for three hours. Great. Like kind of space things out. Does that mean you're working out for the whole three hours? No. Right. The tiny probably working out is obviously significantly less. Um but yeah, like it's just, it's so much more than just the time spent in region. And kind of go back to your question about a new athlete coming in or or an intermediate aspect, like you need to, you need to be able to again self govern and know that like more time at the beginning can be detrimental detrimental to your, to your development. So uh yeah, there is a correlation right? Like a lot of the elite athletes spend multiple hours in a day, but they're spending just as much time if not more time on the recovery, nutrition and sleep

Adam [51:16 - 51:48]
josh. Like you talked about this before and you've talked to the LP compete crew about this, But it's like if you, if you have 60 minutes in the gym, what are you going to prioritize if you have 90 minutes in the gym, what are you going to prioritize? And like, you know, it goes back to Josh's values around building that base, like You're going to train 60 minutes a day, well the base better be the priority. And then if you can add some time in a couple of days a week and you have 90 minutes, then you're going to start to add in the, you know, the skill work and more of the sexy stuff.

Josh [51:49 - 53:08]
Yeah, especially right now during this site, but like our focus is that base. So if you can prioritize kind of the aerobic stuff that we're working on and kind of some of that raw strength embody balance work over kind of maybe some of the mechanisms, some of the skill work like that should be your focus, right? And if you can Sprinkle in some of that other stuff throughout the week, Great. But you know, in our next cycle we're gonna be looking more so into the olympic lifting and skill capacity works like those are going to be our focus, right? So again we're going to focus on those and then as we get closer and closer to the open, we're going to start our open prep, which will again focus more so on combining everything we've worked on and kind of pushing that together. And I think Adam that's something that when we were working together, you know, for your goals, for the open this past year, it was something that was new to you, like how we went through kind of those stages and then it was just like, okay, like that's why you had me doing like so many strict handstand pushups, right? And then we kind of put it all together and now you're doing like a skill called a skilled warm up, but you know, we're incorporating some sort of monta structural piece, some sort of steel piece and maybe a light bar belt. Well, this feels a lot like an openwork. Oh right, so there is kind of a method,

Adam [53:08 - 53:45]
you just reminded me again like this, the prioritization, depending on the time of year, it has been such a learning curve for me because it's so tempting when you finish the opener the quarterfinals or you've just watched it as a new athlete, you want to just get right into learning all those cool things. But really there's a season and a time within the year where you prioritize exactly like you said, raw strength and aerobic base. Now, olympic lifting skill capacity in the fall and then as you get closer to the open then you can start revving the engine up to get ready.

Josh [53:45 - 55:22]
So I think that's just one of the things that is kind of the misperception of crossfit as a sport, is that when people see it, you know, on tv or on Youtube, right? Like they're seeing those elite athletes and they're just saying all this crossfit while the google crossfit and so there's a crossfit gym down the road, like they go in there and they do classes okay, This is what I have to do to get to that level. It's like, well, no, like crossfit wasn't made to get people to the elite level. Crossfit was made to make people healthy, right? Um and so yeah, there was kind of misconception there in terms of like, what's the difference between crossfit is a, you know, health health program and cross it as a sport. So there is definitely a, In my opinion, a big divide between the two. Um Yeah, that's obviously something important to stress to any new athlete coming in who has aspirations of competing at a high level was like, okay, like, you know, get yourself a good coach who understands that. Like it's not, yeah, it's not simple, but there's certain things that need to be down in a certain order and I do think we are seeing a lot more of kind of that mindset coming across and some of the coaching different platforms out there, which is good um so yeah, it's just kind of making sure that you're you're educated before you you died in and and realizing it's not just okay, I'm just gonna do crossfit and be at the games next year, it's like no, maybe, but probably not. Mhm.

Chad [55:23 - 56:20]
Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I mean a lot of people come to the gym and they just want to come to the, to be socially, they don't want to come to the gym to just get a sweat on for an hour, right? And I think those and I think that's that's perfect, right, It gets people off the coach and doing something right? I do wish those same people would, would take a little extra time to kind of like educate themselves, right. Whether it's listening to a podcast or, or whatever and just to get a little bit of a better understanding of why the things happen or why when you step in that gym, why are you doing the things that you're doing right? I think it would really help them. Um yeah, so like talking about sort of continuing conversation with like, uh, you know, LP compete in the programming. You were mentioning how you sort of to some, the training blocks. So how do you structure this season? Do you just kind of work back from, let's say the Open is sort of, let's say the Open is kind of like the super bowl of of this, Do you just work back from there, and then that's how you sort of build in sort of the season

Josh [56:21 - 60:01]
in terms of like the the specific dates or like kind of the transition period between cycles. Yes. Um But it follows I just like this in my opinion, that follows, especially when you're programming for a group of athletes who are following the same program, um it's going to follow like a very similar patterns, so um yeah, we're gonna do a base building and then we're gonna move into kind of that olympic lifting um focused with gymnastic capacity, right? So I bring muscle ups, bar muscle ups, pull ups, handstand, push up, stuff like that. Um and then again, the open prep will probably is usually around like 8-10 weeks prior to the open, right? Like you don't want to start too early because you're going to peak too early. Uh and then you risk kind of burnout, which is a real thing, so um making sure that you kind of do that at the right time. Um and so yeah, in terms of the specific dates, like I'll work back from the open, so if the open is going to be at the end of february, okay, so like eight weeks, we're probably looking, you know, maybe in the december, middle december to start the open prep and You know, we'll probably like 12 weeks, I want to make lifting capacity cycle, so we're looking at three months there. Um so again, that will be coming up fairly soon for the LP can keep crew, like probably got a few more months of what we're doing, but um yeah, I kind of go based on field that kind of information that comes through and one of the things that we will be doing is having kind of like the load weeks, that's super important. You know when you're going through a training block to have kind of a D load or like a reload, we like to call them to where we dial back on kind of the volume and intensity and allow the body to kind of reset because when you're constantly going and going your, I mean if you're not doing all the other things right, and you don't have the rest and nutrition and recovery dialed in, like you do risk that burnout in some things. We'll talk about, adrenal fatigue, right? So um those are things that you definitely want to avoid. And I got one thing I always stress with my athletes when I work with is the ability to self regulate your feeling burned down. Like let me know and I can modify your plan or like we're going to take some time off. It's not the end of the world to take a couple extra days, especially when you know the open or the semifinals is four weeks away. Like taking a couple of days now to let your body reset in, recharge is not going to have an impact on your performance, but if you keep grinding and you wear yourself out and you get hurt or like you just become completely exhausted and now you have to take a week, two weeks, three weeks off now, you're going to have an issue when you're competing, right? So working with younger athletes, that's sometimes hard, like they don't necessarily comprehend the importance of rest and recovery. Um you know, it's minimum thing that I've had to work with Emma and she's concerned sometimes we're like, well, if I'm not doing something like someone else is doing something, like they're getting better, it's like taking rest right now is actually going to make you better. So she's getting better with it as she gets older and kind of understanding the sport, but it's one of those things that is definitely, I think who overlooked by a lot of younger athletes as they come in with the importance of rest and making sure that you're allowing your body to To recover just knock on 100% all the time.

Chad [60:01 - 60:03]
I think all the athletes face the same problems

Josh [60:03 - 60:06]
I got. There you go, thank you. Exactly,

Chad [60:07 - 61:00]
yeah. Um And like how do you like a common thing, you know, after the opener, after whatever, like that's usually open as an example, right? We finished the open, you know, you take a few extra recovery days, you sort of retrospect on sort of how the open went for yourself and you kind of start making goals, right? And so it's like I really next year I want to get a ring muslim and the common thought is okay, you know, day after the open I'm going to start practicing ring muscle ups, right? How do you, like, I'm assuming you don't agree, that's the right thing to do. Like how do you get that athlete to sort of understand that that might not be the right thing to do because you still have another full year of time. How do you get them onto a plan and understand? I guess going back to what you sort of believe in is sort of building a base and then eventually getting to that sort of goal.

Josh [61:01 - 63:43]
So I definitely think there's like a trust thing that has to happen there, right? Like your athlete has to know that you have their goal in mind, right? Like if they want that ring muscle up and that's what they're going after. You need to have that level of trust that, okay, like, hey, trust me to build a plan to get you to that point, and if you ask cute that plan, like you're possibility of getting a ring muscle up is going to dramatically improve. Um Yeah, so like, if we break down the ring muscle up, right? So like, it's a full, it's a push, like there's some kip and dynamic movement in there. So if we're trying to get Mathlete to, you know, get that ring muscle up, you know, we want to start with, okay, can we get you a strict right muscle up first, right? Like, let's not go right to the kip. You know, once you can do a strictly muscle up and we can get a couple of those, then we can start talking about the kipping movement and how that kind of plays in, but without that strict strength and I think that's a lot of times, like I never learned a strict Marie muscle up when I started and I wish I did, like I went straight to a tipping muscle up right and good looking back now, like I wish I had someone who said, hey, you know, like develop that strict strength, get that body awareness and then like you'll find that the keeping the muscles are going to come a lot more naturally and a lot easier, so Mhm. Yeah, again, developing that trust with your athlete and then laying out that plan right, breaking down the movement in developing the strength in those different parts of them do that, so the pull the turnover and then the dip out of it, right? Those are the kind of the three main factors in the muscle up and then kind of getting more into kind of the specific, so with the strict ring muscle up ready, like keeping that body and a slightly Paulo position, staying tight, keeping those rings close to the midline, tracking underneath the pack for the turnover. Those are things that you can teach and there's trails that you can do to practice that. And so I guess like if you're kind of looking at what I've been saying, it's like we're building the pieces of the puzzle and then people are gonna be like, well I haven't done a ring muscle up yet, it's okay, like you have all the pieces now, let's put the puzzle together and it's like, oh gee that I set out to bring muscle up and like it wasn't anything, like I didn't feel like anything, so again, that's kind of my biggest, you know, if someone has a goal of the particular movement, you know, it's it's breaking that movement down, developing those pieces and then bringing that puzzle together. Um and then a lot of times if if they've been doing that work will be pretty surprised at how it's kind of clicks, right? Mhm.

Chad [63:44 - 64:07]
That's awesome, that's great. I think there's, I think there's a lot of folks, they can really learn a lot from that and I know we're getting near the time, so I wanted to ask a few questions, let's do maybe like a two minute drill type of rapid fire type thing, I got a few questions for you sure? Um there the question is probably don't lead into short answers, but we'll see if you keep them something,

Josh [64:07 - 64:09]
I

Chad [64:09 - 64:27]
mean, go on as much as you want to. Um I did want to ask about, like, training versus competing, um this is a common question uh that comes up a lot of podcasts, like what is the right dosage, and how do you uh ensures some of, and I'm not talking about, I guess any athlete again er versus elite, like how do you sort of balance that?

Josh [64:28 - 65:32]
Right? Yeah, so, uh you can train more than you can compete, I guess, in my sense, right? So when you're competing, the intensity level is extremely high, so if you are trying to compete every day you go into the gym, um you're going to burn up, right? Um training is what allows us to maximize our ability when we compete. Right? So going into the gym with the mindset that day, like, this is a training day, this is the purpose of my day, you know, the purpose of my day isn't necessarily to be at the top of the leaderboard in the class, it's to execute X, y and Z and get better at X, Y and Z. So that way, when the open does come, or that competition does come, I'm ready, right? And I think that is one of the things that, again, is kind of, or looked within the the young catholic population is like complete everyday compete every day, be topped the leaderboard, it's train every day with an intent and purpose and when it's time to compete, you'll be ready

Chad [65:33 - 65:36]
again I think, and I would say that it's not just leaving athlete

Adam [65:36 - 65:54]
thing. Yeah, we have this debate a lot, like, you know, there's competing not enough and then there's competing too much, but you're right, if you take the mentality, like when I do compete, I'm putting all my work to a test to see where I'm at.

Josh [65:55 - 66:33]
Well, even at them, if you were to look at, like, you're, you know, we're kind of two minute drills turning into a lot longer. But if you were to look at your triathlon training, right? Like if you were to compete every day in your triathlon training, like you'd be absolutely wrecked, right? Like, you need to like progress and whether it's like a linear progression or like period eyes progression, like, it doesn't matter. But if you compute every day, like, by the time you get to mount trauma, like you're going to be completely fried and like, your performance is not going to be where it could have been. So it's Yeah, I mean, a lot of people get it, but a lot of new athletes, I don't think we understand that the difference between training and competing.

Chad [66:34 - 66:58]
Yeah, I think um you know, it'll be interesting when, you know, the gym's open back up, right, because a lot of people haven't been competing and they're bursting at the seams because competition got them to across the gym competition sort of fueled the, the accountability side of things and they're just going to go and, you know, full speed ahead. So hopefully, you know, some of the gym owners can sort of temper that expectation a little bit.

Josh [66:59 - 67:22]
Yeah, that's what I hope. I think, I think any like gym owner, that's what worth they're like, their self is gonna take that into account, will make sure that things are coming back in, like their programming will reflect that, right. One thing I think we will see is a lot of ripped pants, a lot of bloody hands. I think the first few weeks to act so sure.

Chad [67:23 - 67:26]
What movements do you love programming the most

Josh [67:27 - 68:09]
movements to love program the most? Um I really like strict gymnastic work and body weight work. I think that's super super good. If you have good body awareness and you can move your body well, especially in the strict sense it's going to transfer over to so many other movements. So yeah, I really like to incorporate those, whether it's kind of a stand alone piece or um you know as the LP group will see as we move closer to the open, like we'll start integrating. Um you know some interval based work with some mono structural were tied in with that strict work. So. Cool. Yeah, strict monastic, strict body weight.

Adam [68:09 - 68:10]
Looking forward to that.

Josh [68:11 - 68:13]
You've already been through it.

Adam [68:13 - 68:17]
Yeah. All the secrets,

Josh [68:17 - 68:19]
what

Chad [68:19 - 68:22]
programming do you do like do you take your own medicine?

Josh [68:23 - 69:36]
Uh Yes, I do. So, I mean, not to the extent that um and Jack of training, but if, you know, for example, so when the season ends for them, um you know, whether it's after the semifinals or after the games and you know, we'll probably go into kind of a rebuild phase and some strength work. Um You know, all toy around with some of that strength work and stuff, kind of you, some of that in my own training and and see what works. Um You know, I have dabbled in um some of like the functional bodybuilding stuff with Marcus Philly. Um You know, right now, I'm following a mash mash mafia, kind of like a nine week strength plan. Um I'm just kind of playing around, seeing what's out there, getting used to kind of different perspectives on strength, right? Like there's no no single person knows everything right? So if you can kind of get a really wide view of different things, I think it's only an official to yourself into your athletes, right? So um yeah, so yeah, I think

Adam [69:36 - 69:38]
the lab rat, he's the lab because

Josh [69:38 - 70:07]
I see things, I'm like it looks way too hard for me. I don't like I'll get the kids to do it, but uh yeah, I like to like I wouldn't program anything that um one I don't think that these are capable of doing and to that, you know, I wouldn't be willing to do even though I might not do it, like, you know, I don't want to put them in a position where um it's unrealistic. So

Chad [70:09 - 70:18]
cool. What I have to ask, like what's your thoughts on hypertrophy? Maybe more specifically Thunder bro, my

Josh [70:18 - 71:30]
guys, Jack, um Hey, it has its place, right? So there definitely is a purpose to hypertrophy. Like if you're just looking to get big and look good, the college didn't go for it. Cool, like make sure you do a little bit of cardio too, but um sally pump those muscles full of love and just get huge. But in terms of like a crossfit seen like hypertrophy training um plays a huge role and then kind of just developing um you know, tendon and joint strength, right? Like we're not going to load up the weight super heavy, but we're going to hit a bunch of reps and take that most of the failure. Um And so I guess I would say have more controlled environment, so I'm not asking them to do like 30 snatches at 2 25 like I can get a little dicey right? So um but if we can do, you know, 30 empty bar hang muscle snatches right? And really fatigued those shoulders and get a good pump. Um There definitely is a place for that within that cross the athletes training plan. I think you see, if you look at a lot of the elite athletes training blocks, you definitely see some high purchase the work. Um why they sponsor twice a week?

Adam [71:31 - 71:37]
Sounds like it's maybe a little more functional uh hypertrophy work versus uh cosmetic.

Josh [71:38 - 71:46]
I mean, you want to look good too. Right? So there's always time for some biceps and triceps picture you posted the other day. You buy something was popping up.

Adam [71:46 - 71:47]
That's right. You

Chad [71:47 - 71:52]
don't get in the curl. He always gives us a hard time with the girls, but I secretly think he does. Someone say,

Josh [71:52 - 71:56]
Amen, we're looking for you. I'm looking forward to

Chad [71:56 - 72:04]
fun, friday. Thunder bro. I mean at least that's what I do at the home gym, but maybe we can get help you to kind of come around.

Josh [72:04 - 72:05]
There you go.

Adam [72:06 - 72:08]
You've been working hard on this for a long

Chad [72:08 - 72:31]
Time. I know, I know, I mean uh we actually talked to hebrew canon a few podcasts go and uh he was talking about the 20 squad program um which I mean he has some really great results um for someone more of a lean person versus, you know, Thunder bro, who's, you know, a monster at this point. Um and so yeah, we have a few followers in the, in the community tackling

Josh [72:31 - 72:48]
that 20 wrap program. Yeah, sweet. Yeah, 20 reps is a lot of reps, but definitely like if it works then something to go for and obviously it's working off for Hebrew, He's looking it's looking pretty, yeah, pretty chiseled, pretty strong, which is good.

Chad [72:48 - 73:00]
So yeah, for sure. Um when you sort of, do your programming, do you get sort of joy out of knowing the athletes are going to suffer on a specific work out? Like, do you look at this is like, oh man, this is gonna hurt.

Josh [73:02 - 74:40]
So Yeah, no, like I don't yeah, I don't like to see them necessarily in pain, but I understand the importance of like pushing at certain times. Um one thing that is big is like, so again, we go back to training versus competing, right? So if you are constantly programming for an athlete and their training things that they're going to fail at and they're going to completely demoralize them and destroy them. It's going to destroy the confidence, right? So you want, for the most part, like 95% of time you want to program something that yes, is challenging is going to cause the adaptation and improvement, but you want them to succeed in that event. You want them to succeed in that workout and gain and build confidence. Um you don't just want to destroy them and knock them down, right? So that when they go into a competition, like they have the confidence that hey, like I can do this, I can, I can get this event done and whether they do or they don't, that's beside the point right? Like, but they have that confidence going in because if you go into something already feeling defeated, like what's the point of doing it? Like you're not gonna, you're not gonna do well. So yeah, there is a place where it's like, hey, this workout is like probably not going to finish it, like it's going to suck. Um but most of time like I want my athlete to succeed in that workout to develop that confidence and that's something I can't take away from chris and shot. He talked about it right, Like when he programs a anaerobic piece or a track work out like he he's programming the athlete to succeed, doesn't want him to fail. So

Chad [74:41 - 74:45]
this is a great coaches answer. I think L. P. S in good hands

Adam [74:45 - 75:12]
chad, you know? Yeah you said you nailed it because that's what I love about josh is that there's like a lot of the things that I believe in two, it's just very natural the both of us, you know, think the same. You josh, you talked a lot about um R. P. In the programming and you've talked to me mainly about threshold and like learning what that

Josh [75:12 - 77:26]
is. Yeah yeah yeah we can dive into that a little bit. Um, So again, our pes is like rate of perceived exertion and it's just kind of a scale from 0 to 10 or 0, 12 um Depending on which one you use, I like the ones here at 10. Um, but again, it's going back to kind of that self governing thing, right? Like if you tell someone, okay, I want you to go run four hundreds, like they're just going to go Kill themselves running 400. But if I say, Hey, I want you to run four hundreds at like 70% or RP seven RP eight, then they kind of have the intent and the understanding of what it should feel like, right? So, um, that's why I like using that and then, and then carry that over into like crossfit kind of competition setting. Um, you know, if you take two athletes, right? And we'll just say like one, let's say it will take two cars, right? The car analogies a lot easier. So if you have 1990 Toyota civic or Corolla beat up Crappy, right? And it's going down the highway at 100 km/h, It might be at like 8000 rpm. Right? So that engine is worth going to hired, right? And then you've got your new corvette or whatever fancy car you want And it's going 100 km/h. It's at 2000 rpm. You know, which car is more efficient and which one is going to last longer. Right? That new car is going to be able to go way longer at that pace. Um, then the other one, So that was eventually going to either break down or it's going to have to slow down. So if we can develop And athletes 80% or 80 85 and kind of push that up And make that more sustainable. So now they're new, 85% was maybe their whole 90%. They're going to be able to take that over into that competition setting and kind of use that. Right? So, I'd much rather see an athlete have a really Strong 85-90% threshold and be able to work in that range for a long time, then you have that 100% that only lasts for 30 seconds. Right? So that's kind of where the RP kind of threshold training something.

Adam [77:27 - 78:13]
Yeah, that's that's what I find, you do a great job of building into your you're programming with, you know, work to rest ratios, right? Like in the conditioning pieces, it's not Yes, there's a time and a place for an mrap eight minutes. But for the most part, I see you programming like Complete three rounds, rest 90 seconds, complete three rounds, rest 90 seconds. Where it's like you're finding threshold in that three rounds. Then you're trying to beat that or the repeaters that you had for us last year trying to beat your score the second time through. So you work on, you know, it takes practice to find out what that 85% is.

Josh [78:14 - 79:11]
Yeah, like and the purpose of the computers to was not only to um see if you can slightly improve your time, but it's also kind of a mental thing, right? So if you know that, hey, like I did this in five minutes, like how can I save a couple of seconds? Right. So whether it's transitions or whether it's, you know, maybe a bit of a different strategy with your rest to work ratio or like breaking things up differently, That is kind of another one of the purposes of those, you know, those style of training. Um Again, it's not just to kind of go through the workout. Again, there's a purpose to it. So that way, you know, when we come to the open, like a lot of people who compete, you know, the open comes and they're doing the workouts to three times, well, I hope you're not going in with the same strategy each time. You need to have a different strategy, different approach. Um and if you can practice that leading up, you know, it's going to be a little bit easier when the open comes and you're ready to actually do that.

Adam [79:12 - 79:31]
Yeah, absolutely Coming out hot, you know what I mean? That that's what we're all trying to avoid is hitting that red line and failing two minutes into the workout, which you still see the best athletes in the world do when they get, you know, too excited, they're back on the competition floor, but

Josh [79:31 - 79:33]
no, we're sure

Chad [79:34 - 79:51]
cool. Yeah, so I think we can wrap, I think um I don't know is there any sort of exciting news with that you sort of can leave the audience with about the sort of partnership between LP and Mammoth? Like what's things that come and I think from our side of things that's super exciting to have you involved.

Josh [79:53 - 80:47]
Yeah, I'm super excited. Like obviously when I have reached out, it's something new for me, like programming specifically for a group of athletes, obviously everything I've done before, it's been more individualist. Um so a new challenge in terms of of that for me, which is cool. Um and then we'll see where things go. Like hopefully the gym start opening up and we can start kind of doing a little bit more of those in person seminars, stuffs on the weekends and whatnot gives some people a little bit more insight into kind of the training and the purpose and work on some skilled stuff and yeah, and then kind of see where things go right, like we'll see how things lead into the open and then, you know, if the, this group thing becomes something that's going to be, you know good and then everyone has a good feedback on it and we'll see maybe maybe mammoths will have a, a platform to share it with the world. So

Adam [80:47 - 80:49]
you will

Chad [80:49 - 80:49]
see,

Adam [80:49 - 81:53]
we heard it, we heard it. Yeah, I think it's safe to say that our Rlp compete occur is in good hands in terms of programming and they can trust that if they put in the work over the next eight months, they're going to have a crossfit open like they never had before. So I'm excited. Last year we had four or five brand new athletes to the crossfit open scene from L. P. And we had eight or 10 others that have done it year over year and I think, you know, that the new athletes got a great taste and are excited to put in the work over the next year and the savvy LP veterans saw some insane improvements in their open scores and just, you know, the ability to handle whatever workout was throwing their way. So I'm excited. That was only with, you know, a little taste of, of your programming. I'm excited to see what they can do with a full, you know, season or full year of of solid programming.

Josh [81:54 - 82:06]
No, I'm excited. You got to hope that the gym's open up soon. So if you can get back in and we can add a little bit more variety to the programming. But what we can right now.

Chad [82:07 - 82:23]
Well, thanks a lot for joining. Josh. Really appreciate your time looking forward to. Yeah, the seminars and and having you involved in the L. P. Community. So also stuff. All right, well we'll finish it there. Thanks everyone for listening. Uh Yeah, we'll see you next time. Bye.